Easiest electrical conversion

H

Haggerty

I've been thrust into the electric bike world with the sudden unexpected suspension of my driver's license. In order to get to work i'm planning to build a trike from these plans and likely adding voilamart's 26" rear conversion kit in 1500W.
I'm trying to figure out which kit would be easier to convert, the TimberWolf USS, or the DeltaWolf. I see the Aurora isn't designed for 26". My fear is that the 9 speed cassette on the kit is not removable and that it would not fit as designed. I could use the 26" front wheel drive kits, has anyone used 26" on any of the trike plans for the front tire? Worst case I could switch to another company that uses weaker hub motors on at 20" front.
I prefer a trike because of my colder climate and desire to build a velomobile from it eventually.
 
Now im leaning towards the StreetFox. It would allow the more powerful rear kits out there and would better suit pedal assist without design changes. It seams most velomobiles are built around the reverse trike anyway.
 
Most Delta trikes (2 rear wheels) will allow you some cargo space between and behind the rear wheels. This may be useful being without a car. Even if cargo is no issue you will need to plan where to put a battery and associated control and wiring. On a Streetfox small batteries could go on the front boom or more likely the rear triangle or on a fabricated carrier over the rear wheel. There are velomobiles built around both types though the Tadpole (one rear wheel) is more prevalent. If the trike has to replace a car some cargo carrying is a likely consideration. I would agree the Streetfox or Warrior would make electrifying easier.
 
Simple electrification of a Warrior tadpole with a mid-drive conversion is easy. The only difficulty is in mounting the control panel and the battery. I don't know about 1500W though. There are road laws about power output levels.

In any case, you will require a strong enough construction to absorb the drive energy.
 
vk3ckc said:
Simple electrification of a Warrior tadpole with a mid-drive conversion is easy. The only difficulty is in mounting the control panel and the battery. I don't know about 1500W though. There are road laws about power output levels.

In any case, you will require a strong enough construction to absorb the drive energy.
Click to expand...

Yeah, it seems a mid-drive is the easy way for an already designed delta trike. I'm not much for laws as thats why my license is suspended in the first place. I was looking at 1500W because its very hilly in my area and I was planning to add weight with a cabin for comfort, similar to this build I found on the forum: https://atomiczombie.com/forum/threads/fat-delta.223/page-5#post-4311
I figure with a 28mph limiter it wont be scrutinized. The kit has a 750w limiter as well if someone does want to look too closely.
I did notice the DeltaRunner Comfort appears to have a 26" front tire by design, that could suit a 1000W frontal conversion with ease.
Also my local laws are contradicting a bit and may not even allow trikes.
Here they define bicycle as: "Bicycle" means every vehicle propelled solely by human power upon which any person may ride, having 2 tandem wheels, except scooters and similar devices.
Here they define bicycle as: "Bicycle" shall mean every pedalled vehicle propelled by human power upon which any person may ride, except child's tricycles and similar devices. The term shall include "electric bicycle."
The second definition makes me want to build the four wheeled streetfighter model. It was a 3rd party e-bike site that mentioned bikes could be 2 or 3 wheels in New Hampshire, but im not seeing that in the official laws, unless the 2nd definition trumps the 1st.
 
vk3ckc said:
mid-drive conversion is easy.
Click to expand...

I decided I was spending too much time trying to decide if I want to build a bike or buy someone elses. I pulled the trigger on buying a mid-drive setup from BAFANG.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07KYBWV2Q/ref=ppx_od_dt_b_asin_title_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
750W T44 with 750c display for $440, Amazon Prime, so I should get it in 2 days.
I have a nice cannondale bike I can convert for now to hold me over, just need to find a good battery and charger option.

edit: just purchased my battery pack, hopefully I didnt make a mistake in the rush to get decide on one quickly. $302 shipped for a 48v 20AH pack. I went with one that said they were shipping from the US since I hate waiting for chinese shipments.
https://www.uppbattery.com/ship-fro...00w-electric-fat-bike-with-charger-p0888.html
 
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Bafang is a good choice, I have had nothing but success with mine.
However, like any bike ridden at speed, bear in mind that with the extra speed comes extra risk of injury whether through your own actions or the actions/inactions of others.
I came off mine at c.30MPH and the surgery to fix what I broke was not pleasant and the recovery time was over a year.
It could all too easily have meant a life being fed mushed food from a spoon and I was lucky to escape with relatively minor injuries.
Good Luck!
 
One issue with a Delta trike is stability and the need for a differential drive unless you want to constantly keep correcting the steering as it will tend to want to go in circles with one rear wheel driving. Not to bad if only pedaling but with a motor it will enhance the issue. Then there is the stability, a Delta has a tendency to tip over.
Hopefully you ordered a USB programming cable to control the top speed and input wheel diameter etc.
I myself have a Street fox w/ same motor setup (Bafang is a great choice)and when I first tested the setup on jacks, the display showed 38mph in high gear. "No Way Jose", I butchered the gear changer for LOW gear only and programmed for max mph of 18mph. Scarred the you know what when I had to turn at 23mph BUT all three wheels stayed on the ground.
good luck. For installation help look at Luna Cycles.There is a Canadian supplier but ???name
 
The install looks like it will be pretty straight forward. I just havent been able to tell what battery connectors the Bafang ships with now, and what my battery will ship with. I think I have XT60's laying around the house somewhere from my R/C days if I need to rewire them. The kit comes with a display, looks like I can set top speed on that, as well as wheel size. I'm starting with a standard Cannondale bicycle, then will buy the plans for the DeltaRunner Comfort and the Streetfighter and go from there. I worry about trike tipping over, and from the looks of it, 4 wheel bicycle is legal in New Hampshire, so might go that route and figure out how to power both rear wheels together instead of doing the powerwheels method of one wheel.
 
I built that enclosed delta trike you looked at on this site. It uses a Bafang BBSO2 and is one wheel drive. Despite what MrIdaho said I have not noticed any need to correct the steering, it goes straight just fine. And for stability well given that it is meant for weather protection and has a relatively upright pedalling stance it for sure is not meant to corner fast. Also since i often overbuild (read that as heavy) and it uses 4 inch wide 26 inch tires it's a power hog so range is some what limited. To that end I keep a minimum of 2 48V batteries in the back. Where I live a 4 wheel bike is legal but you cannot put a motor on it so for me it's trikes. Really its possible to flip over anything, I got cocky on my Warrior and tipped it over in a high speed 90 degree turn, I have no desire to do that again.
 
Exceed the capabilities of anything and you are a passenger until it stops. Therefore, don't do it.

A battery should only have two wires as far as power supply is concerned. The rest comes as part of the Bafang control system - brake switching, assist level control, speed monitoring, on/off, etc. I also echo DannyC's Bafang comments and my Bafang battery shipped with a pair of wires with bullet connectors one end and bare ends to be soldered to the battery mount bracket at the other. The beauty of a mid-drive conversion is that you can swap it from one ride to another - it only takes time but save a bit of coin.

There are those that will say that you don't have to use the brake switching and, to a point, that may be true. It all depends on whether you can accept the drive motor continuing to power everything for half a second or so after you stop pedalling. I do not use them on my Warrior but I do intend to on eLecTricks. My first use of the Bafang was on a two wheeler and I used the brake switches then. In reality, I don't notice the continued power when braking on the Warrior.
 
The 750W Bafang has been working great. I wonder Hugh, do you have any problems stripping your rear sprockets with that much weight? I've stripped one and am beginning to skip the chain on my 2nd one from too much power in top gear. I'm trying to remember to use the lower gears as much as possible as they have more contact surface with the chain, but if I get on it in top gear it will skip. I just ordered a 52T front even though my commute has some serious hills. I'm only using gear 5-9 on the rear with the 44T. I'm trying to think of a sturdier option for when I build a 4 wheel heavy bike. I could go with a motorcycle style chain, but then I'd run into the problems of shifting gears. I think I can skirt the rules by having two 1500W or 1000W hub motors and only having power to them when im pedaling a generator. Anything is a bicycle here as long as its pedal assisted. But then that setup would be no different than installing pedals in a Tesla and calling it a bike.
 
I'm contemplating to change the thin bicycle gears with larger industrial gears and chain, if I can make'm work with the ratchet on the Alfine 11 hub I have.
 
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Haggerty I now have put a few hundred km,s on the delta. It originally had a shimeng freewheel on it but that had problems at 20 below C, the pawls froze and would not engage. After a short time they started to engage again but I had to be very light on the power. The next day I got a Shimano freewheel and installed it, no issues since. As far as the chain skipping , that has not happened yet, but - yes theres always a but -I,ve set my gearing choice to mostly using the 3rd gear out of 7 and running power level 3 or 4 so speed runs between 16 and 20 km,s roughly. That gets me were I want to go and maximizes battery power.
 
Mine will follow in a week or 2. But that won't be a AtomicZombie worthy conversion. An Azub Tricon 26 will be equipped with the Bafang 750W mid drive.
 
If you consider that competition cyclists can only achieve 400W average output anything over that is a bit OTT perhaps.
I fully understand that just having 750W doesn't mean you will use the full 750 all the time but 360 watts will get you cruising at 15MPH or better, how much faster do you need to go?
I came off my trike at just over 29MPH on a downhill stretch and the resulting ground impact wasn't gentle, the repair surgery was extremely painful and the recovery period lengthy.
Be warned, and be careful. ;)
 
The install was done today. It's dead easy, and works great out of the box.

On the other hand, installing me in that extremely light and comfortable seal....

I can give 2 tumbs up on ease of installing and setting up. Now to see how it takes 10K km a year.
 
vk3ckc said:
Simple electrification of a Warrior tadpole with a mid-drive conversion is easy. The only difficulty is in mounting the control panel and the battery. I don't know about 1500W though. There are road laws about power output levels.

In any case, you will require a strong enough construction to absorb the drive energy.
Click to expand...
There it is again... A strange idea of laws interfering with bicycle electrification & power output is... Well, ugly. Yes, that probably describes it in acceptable terms. Why is that rubbish even allowed?
 
DannyC said:
Bafang is a good choice, I have had nothing but success with mine.
However, like any bike ridden at speed, bear in mind that with the extra speed comes extra risk of injury whether through your own actions or the actions/inactions of others.
I came off mine at c.30MPH and the surgery to fix what I broke was not pleasant and the recovery time was over a year.
It could all too easily have meant a life being fed mushed food from a spoon and I was lucky to escape with relatively minor injuries.
Good Luck!
Click to expand...
I read mention of your excursion close to the Twilight Zone as bones healed this winter & spring, am glad you is still amongst us, & I am robustly unanimous in that, sir. Things happening at 30+ mph includes momentary excitement. I got to enjoy most of December in hospital & rehab after a hit & run truck nailed me at 30 to 40. Bless God, I'm not a vegetable on a hose. Relearning to walk using aftermarket parts was not listed in my travel itinerary. When I can drag my recumbent bike out, exercise will progress. Soon after that, I'll be pedaling uprights again, too. Do you still clank when you walk? Sudden impact was only 2 (yup, two) weeks after I finally started wearing a helmet.
 
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